DISC BRAKES!?!

[Eamonn McG]

Hey All, its been a while since I've posted I've had a lot going on. Just moved to ASHEVILLE North Carolina and loving it. Big issues with the van though. I had a leaky master cylinder prior to my trip down here from Jersey and I needed to get it fixed before I took the 900 mile drive. Anyway, my question is this. I could have SWORE I had disc brakes on the rear of my 91 B190. I even remember having a discussion with a mechanic friend of mine about how it had discs in the back end. After having my brakes worked on at a place I had VERY STRONG feelings about not going to ( nobody else could put it on the lift and I needed ball joints as well so I had to suck it up and bring it there ) Long story short I had them work on the brakes and they told me they had to replace the calipers because a line seized as well as work on the master cylinder. I told them whatever they needed to do to get the brakes going strong to do, $1,600 later and a drive to north Carolina my brakes literally almost caught fire yesterday. smoke was billowing out of the front wheel wells and the brakes got real spungee feeling. had to let them cool for a half hour before I felt ok to drive again. My question here is 2 fold, one, do 91's come with discs on the rear? because now I've got drums and they look like brand new drums. I'm wondering if these shifty mechanics swapped them out on me....and 2, what can I do about my brakes smoking? It wasn't any abrupt stop, just a steady downhill coming down the blue ridge parkway. the problem is they're warrantied but the closest place is 700 miles north in PA. Any advice helps

[URStruly]

My '91 with a 460 engine has rear drum brakes. They did not swap out on you. The mountains can put a lot of strain on brakes, more than you might realize. Your unit is 9000#+. Drive a couple miles on fairly level road and see if your brakes get hot if they do your brake system may be keeping pressure on your pads and not releasing. Possibly the pads are standard duty instead of heavy duty pads. You need to talk to a brake specialist about the correct pads for your application.

[Kentuckian]

Factory configuration is disk front and drum rear.

Regarding the spongey feel... brake fluid absorbs water over time. Some manufacturers recommend changing your brake fluid annually. When the brake fluid loads up with water and the system gets hot, the water in the fluid can boil out creating gas that could coorespond to the spongey feel that you noticed. Additionally, since you reported having brake work that might have included opening the hydrualic lines to repair a "seized line", you may have air bubbles in the line. Either way it would be a low cost measure to bleed your brake lines with fresh brake fluid. If done competently it should address both of the above points.

Regarding smoke, are you sure which wheels generated the smoke? A single wheel smoking, might indicate a hydraulic system issue.

Since you mentioned new drums on the back, you may also want to have someone you trust check that the rear brakes have been adjusted properly. You want to make sure that they are fully engaging to support the front disc brakes.

[Keystone]

URStruly and Kentuckian have given great brake advice. The only thing I can add, and it's what I do in the mountain terrain here, is down shift and let the transmission do more of the work. Good luck. Smoking, spongy brakes are not fun.

[Eamonn McG]

Thanks all.

The issue is I've had the van all over the country. This isn't the first time I've had them in serious mountains and I've never experienced issues like that. Kentuckian, it was both front wheels smoking like they literally just caught fire. They got so hot that when I put my hand on a lug nut I literally got a burn that turned to a blister. My first thought was maybe I glazed them when I stomped on them so hard. But I took the front wheel off and the rotors don't look shiny or purpleish so I don't think that's the case. I did notice however once I got it onto the flats that as soon as I let off the gas it slowed dramatically, which made me think maybe they weren't disengaging as you'd mentioned. I know typically letting off the gas you slow a bit but even on the down hill as soon as I let off the gas I would drop about 15 mph fast. I know when they replaced the master cylinder they did bleed them. I think at this point i'll drive around on the flats to see how they feel and take it to someone I trust. now I need to figure out a way to back charge whatever I have to pay this new place to the ETD that initially did the work as they warrantied all work for a year.

[Planck]

I am on my 2nd B190. The first, a 91, had been sitting for quite a while before I bought it. Our first trip resulted in the smoking front brakes you describe. Fortunately we were near a brake shop(good one) that replaced both front calipers, as they were not fully releasing. They said this can happen from lack of use. Our current 1993, to be safe, I replaced the front calipers and hoses this summer as I don't want that experience again. Not a hard job for a do-it-yourselfer. I think I posted pictures in the album. Rear brakes, as stated are drum. I suppose it is possible to overheat the front brakes, but they are designed for the load and judicious driving and brake use should result in limited overheating. Going down steep grades I try to go slower than modern cars, use the lower gear(although I would rather wear out brakes more than the transmission), and go as easy on the brakes as possible.

Sorry about your bad experience. I would call the shop and tell them your experience to see how cooperative they are going to be.

Phil

[Marko Polo]

I had an almost identical issue last winter immediately after a brake job. The rubber boots on my calipers literally CAUGHT FIRE and melted off. Going through Death Valley I had to pull over every 15 minutes and let them cool for 15, spray some cool water on them, and drive another 15 minutes.

Ended up driving some 600 miles to the next warrantied shop which was on our route. They replaced the calipers/master cylinder/etc. all again. And it STILL got extremely hot.

Which brings me to the point: I still haven't solved the issue. They still get extremely hot on declines - even with downshifting and minimal braking. So yea, don't listen to me, but if anyone out there has some sage advice, we're listening. I suppose I could tighten up the drums on the rear - but that's not going to have a huge effect.

[Planck]

I just Googled "E350 breaks overheating"

Lots of info there. Here is one thread:

https://forums.woodalls.com/Index.cfm/f ... 187913.cfm

Phil

[lido14co]

Any chance overheating could be related to a problem with the rear ABS?


Cliff