Weird engine hiccup still persists

Can't go anywhere without a working drivetrain
jb1rd73
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Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by jb1rd73 »

Ok, so I finally drove the van again this weekend after putting in the the Sea Foam, Initially I put it in and drove it 35 miles home and then it sat for the week but the "hiccup" though better, ie not as abrupt or as constant is still there. So I changed the fuel filter thinking that it might need it after sitting for 8+ months, drove it and it is still doing it, any thoughts????? I don't know what to look at next, plugs, wires, tune up type of situation or possibly transmission? Taking it out to Ocala today for an overnight shakedown with the wifey, so hope it is nothing major. Will start tearing into it mid week to see if we can't get it figured out, with any luck my neighbor will be back from his trip and is a handy old wrench :)
Keystone
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by Keystone »

This problem sounds familiar. Search on words here like "missing" "jerky" "intermittent" "pcm" "ecm" "bucking" and you'll get an eyeful. If it does turn out to be the the pcm, Solo Automotive Electronics (in Florida) can provide the software upgrade that has worked for many. In my case, we sent them my board to fix, but Solo determined it already had "the upgrade" and sent it back--no charge. But my symptoms were different than the hiccup thing that you have--more like a stalling thing when hot. (That problem was the fuel pump.)

So good luck! I hope others who solved this hiccup problem will chime in to help out.
jb1rd73
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by jb1rd73 »

Thanks Keystone, we loaded up for the trip and promptly turned around, I am taking it to the mechanic to see if they can diagnose it. The problem is noticeable when the engine has reached cruising, under load/acceleration it does not do it, it will also seem to "surge" at idle and even when you come to a stop light and have the brake applied it feels as if it wants to lurch forward a bit. Fingers crossed, I'll report back after I hear from the mechanic.
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lido14co
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by lido14co »

Interested to see what the problem is. My 92 hiccups briefly about once an hour but runs smoothly despite the hiccup.


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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by mtnmanb »

Mine does the same thing, good to hear that I'm not alone. I get it to cruising speed and it sputters a bit until I let off the gas or give it a few pumps. Happens once in a while, nothing consistent. Mechanic is baffled, can't figure out what's wrong after cleaning the fuel injector and replacing the fuel bar. Basically said he can start replacing other parts piece by piece, but would only recommend that if it totally stopped working...

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skater
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by skater »

Are these all the same engine? (460 or 351?)
1991 Airstream B190 - bought, 2005; sold, 2011; bought 2017
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jb1rd73
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by jb1rd73 »

Mine is the 460, in the process of a full tune, plugs, wires, cap and rotor. I took it into the mechanic and he could find nothing wrong and as I was going to do this any way I figured it a good place to start. It looks to be all the original parts, yikes 20 years old, I guess the previous owners said to hell with it since it had low miles, only 69k when I bought it. Just an FYI the front 2 passenger side plugs and the very front driver side plug are PIA to get at, I am all ears if anyone has any suggestions. The other 5 were easy peasy!
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lido14co
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by lido14co »

I have the 351. Symptoms are a bit different with mine. It's as if you flipped a switch off and on once really fast, just a slight stutter. All the gauges remain working and there's no power loss, just a blip. It's happened ever since we bought it three years ago. I'll just live with it until it stops!


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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by skater »

jb1rd73 wrote:Mine is the 460, in the process of a full tune, plugs, wires, cap and rotor. I took it into the mechanic and he could find nothing wrong and as I was going to do this any way I figured it a good place to start. It looks to be all the original parts, yikes 20 years old, I guess the previous owners said to hell with it since it had low miles, only 69k when I bought it. Just an FYI the front 2 passenger side plugs and the very front driver side plug are PIA to get at, I am all ears if anyone has any suggestions. The other 5 were easy peasy!
I don't recall having a major problem with the passenger side plugs, though they're not easy. But that front plug on the driver's side...ugh. I remember spending more time on that one plug than on the other 7 combined! You just have to get your hand in there, unfortunately. I think one of the spark plug sockets that has a magnet in it to hold the plug (instead of the rubber boot) would be helpful, if they still make them.

Those are good things to change, especially if they're original! But in both cases I would wonder if there's a fuel issue, perhaps the tank selector is going bad, or the fuel filter is clogged. Also, try to note if it only happens when you're on one tank or the other - perhaps one of the fuel pumps is going a bit wonky on you (I believe there's one in each tank). It comes down to three things - fuel, air, and spark. Air usually isn't the issue (unless the air filter is REALLY bad).
1991 Airstream B190 - bought, 2005; sold, 2011; bought 2017
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jb1rd73
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by jb1rd73 »

There is only one tank 92 and up, I changed the fuel filter first, I did manage to get the plugs, wires, cap and rotor installed to no avail. So the hunt continues, the mech. said that there were no codes and the computer was reading so did not think it was ECM or PCM. After taking it out after the plug and wires, here is what I noticed; the jerking, stuttering, hiccup, surge, whatever you want to call it is most noticeable between 30 and 45 mph with 40-5 seeming to be the worst. It does not do it under any acceleration load or when coasting only at cruising speed,if I had a tach I could tell exactly what rpm but think around 2200-400(?) At higher speeds 55-65 it is still present but faint, less abrupt. The same mech. suggested the EGR valve, but seemed clueless to anything else, are there no real mechanics any more, he said he was lost without the computer telling him what to do, and that the antiquated computer in my van might as well be nothing at all. 8O
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skater
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by skater »

jb1rd73 wrote:There is only one tank 92 and up, I changed the fuel filter first, I did manage to get the plugs, wires, cap and rotor installed to no avail. So the hunt continues, the mech. said that there were no codes and the computer was reading so did not think it was ECM or PCM. After taking it out after the plug and wires, here is what I noticed; the jerking, stuttering, hiccup, surge, whatever you want to call it is most noticeable between 30 and 45 mph with 40-5 seeming to be the worst. It does not do it under any acceleration load or when coasting only at cruising speed,if I had a tach I could tell exactly what rpm but think around 2200-400(?) At higher speeds 55-65 it is still present but faint, less abrupt. The same mech. suggested the EGR valve, but seemed clueless to anything else, are there no real mechanics any more, he said he was lost without the computer telling him what to do, and that the antiquated computer in my van might as well be nothing at all. 8O
My new guess: Torque converter is going bad. Take it to a good transmission shop. Mine was doing something very similar (I didn't recognize it until I saw this description), and after the transmission spewed out its coolant all over, the shop that looked at it mentioned that the torque converter was also going bad, describing the symptoms perfectly (I hadn't mentioned those symptoms to the shop because I thought they were engine related and I was having a huge transmission problem). In my case, by that time, it was much worse, but it started as an occasional sputter very much like you describe.

Here's the thing - I took mine to a transmission shop several months before that incident, and they couldn't replicate it, so I continued to chase phantom engine issues. The second shop, however, described the noise to me perfectly, and the new transmission install fixed it.
1991 Airstream B190 - bought, 2005; sold, 2011; bought 2017
1995 Airstream Excella 30' trailer

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jb1rd73
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by jb1rd73 »

Thanks Skater, I have a tranny service on my to do list and will try to get it done sooner than later, as in next thing on the list, hopefully its just bad fluid, I am pretty sure it is the original, being low miles my guess is that the PO's did not change it, seeing how the plugs and wires were the originals. Going to clean the MAF and TB next and put the new air filter in and check the EGR, trying to check off the low/no cost options first. Will have them flush and fill the cooling system too.
*****EDIT, tranny service scheduled for Tues, hoping it fixes the problem, not a big fan of wild goose chases.
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by Keystone »

Random transmission thoughts...Have you experimented with "manual" shifting and does it still hiccup? Is the hiccup around the shift points? Is 35mph in 2nd gear the same as 35mph in 3rd gear? Just looking for more detail in the hiccup thing.

A few things I did that I think delayed the transmission replacement for me: switched to B.G. synthetic automatic transmission fluid (with a flush), and added a transmission cooler (which was ultimately discarded when I replaced the tranny (at 48K miles) because the new one came with its own, much bigger cooler). If you can delay the transmission replacement until you get out to CO, there's a great transmission shop in Commerce City. Old-fashioned type of mechanic. Also, if in fact you need a new tranny, makes sense to do that before or with the 4x4 conversion because the shaft will likely need modification--and why do it twice?

FWIW, my van throws an EGR code (332) that reappears after it is cleared. And my van does not have the hiccup. I have not tried to fix it. Maybe this year...

I had vacuum leaks chased down and fixed. That restored my air conditioning and heated air delivery to the dash and floor vents instead of the defrost vents, but did not change the vehicle operation that I could detect.

A MAP sensor was replaced in my van and nothing seemed to change.

Finally, the software upgrade on the ECM board is a $150 fix that some people had good luck with on this site. But, I think many of those vans have new owners now since the fix, so the history is probably lost. My van already had the fix when I bought it.

Congrats on the tuneup. I hope there's an easy resolution just up ahead for you.
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by skater »

jb1rd73 wrote:not a big fan of wild goose chases.
Me either, and transmissions issues are often the wildest of them, in my experience. I hate having transmission issues!

I strongly recommend going on a test drive with the shop and demonstrate it, so they know exactly what you're talking about.
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jb1rd73
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Re: Weird engine hiccup still persists

Post by jb1rd73 »

Thanks Keystone, what's your name by the way seems weird calling people by a forum name. I'm Jason in the real/physical world[GRINNING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]


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