Installing Solar Panels

Electrical issues, both 12 volt and 120 volt
User avatar
Mark
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:03 pm
B190 Year: 1997
WBCCI: 0
Location: I get my mail in Carson City, NV

Installing Solar Panels

Post by Mark »

I just received all the components for my solar system.
Given that the B190 comes with a wire poking out of the roof for future solar panels, I suspect the other end is near the current inverter or coach battery. In my research of solar I've leaned that the wire Airstream has provided is way, way to small to efficiently pass the solar power to the batteries.

I would like to replace this wire. Has anyone done that?

It would be great if I could merely tape the new, thicker wire onto the old, thinner wire and pull it through to the inverter. It MIGHT work if the run doesn't have any sharp corners and is a fairly straight path. I'd rather do that than have to figure out some other way to get that wire into the rig.
Attachments
Solar-Kit.jpg
Solar-Kit.jpg (122.06 KiB) Viewed 14917 times
If it ain't fun - it ain't done!
User avatar
Kentuckian
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 346
Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:52 pm
B190 Year: 1993
WBCCI: 0
Location: Kentucky, USA

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Kentuckian »

Hi Mark,

Congratulations on getting your solar gear in.

I would have preferred to install bigger gauge wire when I installed my 100watt panel. However, the factory solar cable on my '93 did not want to pull and I didn't want to disassemble the interior panels if I did not have to. So, I used the existing Airstream solar wire cable. My system is working fine with no significant voltage drop down to the charge controller. To our favor we are only talking a short run of cable on our vans compared to an install on a house.

One caution that I would give you, is to make sure that you install the panel so that at no time any portion of the panel is shaded by the AC hood or the ceiling exhaust fan. Even a little shadow kills a substantial portion of the panel's output. Also in the winter, a tilt mount will let you increase your output substantially (60~80%) over have the panel flat on the roof.

My Airstream solar cable terminated inside the factory charge controller box with wire nuts on the ends of the conductors.
1993 Airstream B190
User avatar
Mark
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:03 pm
B190 Year: 1997
WBCCI: 0
Location: I get my mail in Carson City, NV

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Mark »

Thanks, Kentuckian,

I'd really like to use those wires but they are so much smaller than what is recommended. I'm going to try to pull them today but if that doesn't work I think I'm going to run the wires down the side of the AC to that air vent, down that and then out to the batteries.

I've read about shadows on solar panels but on the B190, unless you raise the panels above the AC and van, there is not much you can do to avoid them. There ain't much real estate up there!

Where is the factory charge controller box?
If it ain't fun - it ain't done!
User avatar
Mark
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:03 pm
B190 Year: 1997
WBCCI: 0
Location: I get my mail in Carson City, NV

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Mark »

I spent the morning opening every spot I could find that had clusters of wires. Some showed nothing new, others were interesting.

The first photo shows where my battery used to be. The red wire goes from the battery, through the battery box, up through the floor and screws into that bar. From the bar I suspect it travels under the rig over to my fuse panel.
Those were the only wires connected to the battery. The smaller red and black wires are for a portable solar panel I used this summer.
battery box
battery box
battery-box.jpg (111.43 KiB) Viewed 14885 times
That red wire, I believe, is the same large red wire that is attach to the right most and highest coupling in the next photo.
Elec Panel
Elec Panel
Elec-Panel.jpg (133.7 KiB) Viewed 14885 times
This is also where my RV manual show my "Power Converter" to be. I suspect that it is the thing on the bottom. You can see my 12v panel and to the left of it, my 110v panel.

This panel is just behind the driver's seat and facing out to the side entry door.

Given that there was only one wire connection to the coach battery, I'm figuring (hoping) that I can run the wires from the solar panels down to the coach battery (through the MPPT, of course), connect them to the batteries along with that one wire and, Voila! done deal, solar power IN!

I'm then figuring that I'll put my inverter on the outside of the cabinet, just right of the fuse panel and behind the driver's seat.

I'm a little bit sketchy on exactly how the inverter is going to connect to the panel but I suspect that the red wire coming from the batteries will go to it.
If it ain't fun - it ain't done!
User avatar
Kentuckian
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 346
Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:52 pm
B190 Year: 1993
WBCCI: 0
Location: Kentucky, USA

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Kentuckian »

Mark wrote:Where is the factory charge controller box?
The Airstream factory charge controller is the bottom section of your photo that has the title "Elec Panel". Those electronics provide charge to your house battery when it is turned on at the breaker panel and the B190 is connected to shore power.

To find the Airstream solar wires, I would pop the cover off of the Airstream solar wiring box on the roof and see what color and size the wires are. Then look for that same wire either poked into the back of the "Elec Panel" box or loose just behind that box under the sofa. The end of the wire inside the B190 would normally not be connected to anything as long as no previous owner had a solar installation. On my install, I confirmed that I had the correct wires by using my test meter.
1993 Airstream B190
User avatar
Mark
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:03 pm
B190 Year: 1997
WBCCI: 0
Location: I get my mail in Carson City, NV

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Mark »

Yes, thanks, Kentuckian, I had just figured that out. Given that I'll be using an inverter/charger, I'll disconnect the charge controller.

My question for the day is:
AC-Out.jpg
AC-Out.jpg (95.15 KiB) Viewed 14870 times
Are the AC IN wires where I would connect the inverter/charger to the generator?
If it ain't fun - it ain't done!
User avatar
Kentuckian
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 346
Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:52 pm
B190 Year: 1993
WBCCI: 0
Location: Kentucky, USA

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Kentuckian »

Someone else will have to answer, as I don't use a generator and am not familiar with the Magnum inverter/controller.
1993 Airstream B190
kitemanks
Weekend Camper
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2013 2:42 pm
B190 Year: 1994
WBCCI: 0

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by kitemanks »

I guess I'm just not following the question and I think your trying to do to much work here. I have a gen set, power converter or electrical box, and I recently installed solar panels. What I did was run a 100 watt panel to my front window up top,( and I have plans for one up on the roof). I ran the regularly sized wire that is (larger than the stock wire) to a solar charge controller (that you probably got with your solar panels,I'm thinking this is what your calling your inverter/charger??) and ran it to the large red wire on the right in the top portion of your picture labeled electric panel. This runs to the house battery hot. The larger white wire at the red wire's 5:00 is the negative I believe for the house battery. These are the 2 wires you want to tie into if what is coming out of your charger is 12 volts. If you are planning to run an inverter off of your house battery to provide AC power this would be the wire maybe not the place to tie into as well depending on how many amps you will be drawing, although I wouldn't do that. I would run a designated thicker wire for that. I'm sure you have seen how thick the wire is that comes with those 12volt to 120 volt inverters. Its practically jumper cable size, and for good reason.

When the generator is running it not only generates AC voltage but runs that AC voltage to a charger that charges the 12 volt house battery. I don't think you need to run any wires there If your just wanting to have your panels charge your house battery.

Here is a look at my set up. Although both wires on the far right of the photo are black one is Positive and one is negative corresponding to what I said above. The large screw post with the red wire is positive and the large screw post with the white wire is negative. These wires accept 12 volt charge from the on board converter, that is why I tied into them and I've had no problems.
Image
and open... although both wires are black one is positive and the other negative from the solar controller.
Image


And yes those wires with wire nuts on the the bottom of the panel are the stock solar trickle charging wires.


Hope this helps
Eric
User avatar
Mark
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:03 pm
B190 Year: 1997
WBCCI: 0
Location: I get my mail in Carson City, NV

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Mark »

I've been working on my solar system lately.
inverter-and-batt-area-before.jpg
inverter-and-batt-area-before.jpg (100.77 KiB) Viewed 14758 times
I removed that partition and added a sort of floor to get above those pipes.
Battery-and-Inverter-area-1.jpg
Battery-and-Inverter-area-1.jpg (112.31 KiB) Viewed 14758 times
battery-and-inverter-area-2.jpg
battery-and-inverter-area-2.jpg (95.76 KiB) Viewed 14758 times
If it ain't fun - it ain't done!
User avatar
Mark
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:03 pm
B190 Year: 1997
WBCCI: 0
Location: I get my mail in Carson City, NV

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Mark »

I had originally thought the inverter would sit flat in that thin area but it was too wide. I added a piece of plywood to that wall and screwed the inverter, on it's side, to that.
I put one battery down in the compartment the original one was and played the other down on the floor and boxed it off with some strips of 1/2" x 1/2". I'll probably use some plumbers tape to really secure it down.
inverter,-batts,-fuse-and-switch.jpg
inverter,-batts,-fuse-and-switch.jpg (107.92 KiB) Viewed 14758 times
and covered the whole area (I'll stain it soon).
battery-and-inverter-area-3.jpg
battery-and-inverter-area-3.jpg (95.01 KiB) Viewed 14758 times
Right above that area, I set the MPPT and the Inverter Remote.
mppt-and-inverter-control.jpg
mppt-and-inverter-control.jpg (121.75 KiB) Viewed 14758 times
If it ain't fun - it ain't done!
User avatar
Mark
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:03 pm
B190 Year: 1997
WBCCI: 0
Location: I get my mail in Carson City, NV

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Mark »

Today I was able to use the garage of a local auto shop. I need the rig to be dry and warm so that the glue on the solar panel feet attached well.

While the garage and rig was warming up, I drilled a hole in the black vent pipe in the closet and ran the wire from the combiner box, alongside the AC, and then down the air vent, to the batteries. I then made up the combiner box and connected the solar panels.
Combiner-box.jpg
Combiner-box.jpg (95.18 KiB) Viewed 14756 times
I cleaned the fiberglass roof of the rig and positioned the panels. Each panel sat a bit on that sloped area between the two roof heights. I had to make sure the feet on that area sat nice and flat.
Panel-Feet-set.jpg
Panel-Feet-set.jpg (120.36 KiB) Viewed 14756 times
I then set them.
Finished.jpg
Finished.jpg (122.22 KiB) Viewed 14756 times
Last edited by Mark on Fri Dec 26, 2014 11:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
If it ain't fun - it ain't done!
User avatar
Mark
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:03 pm
B190 Year: 1997
WBCCI: 0
Location: I get my mail in Carson City, NV

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Mark »

Since the garage had a beefy lift I got the rig up onto it and ran the wire, through the floor, under the rig and back up to the fuse box.
underside.jpg
underside.jpg (118.21 KiB) Viewed 14756 times
Tomorrow I'll connect the inverter to the fuse panel. I'm waiting on some wires to connect the batteries
fuse-panel.jpg
fuse-panel.jpg (133.7 KiB) Viewed 14756 times
All I'll have left is to set two USB plugs, a household plug and wire the stereo to the coach batteries.
If it ain't fun - it ain't done!
nvestysly
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 149
Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2014 4:22 pm
B190 Year: 1998
WBCCI: 16771

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by nvestysly »

Thanks for the detailed pictures and notes. That looks like it's going to be a very useful solar installation.

In one of your pictures I see you have the old style, single-stage converter. For another $200 you could switch it out to the more modern multi-stage charging system. The multi-stage charging converters typically provide much longer battery life - important for your top of the line Lifeline batteries - by giving the batteries only the charge they need, ranging from trickle, to full-charge and several steps in between.

I'm sure somebody on the forum knows much more about the multi-stage converters than I do and can explain this more eloquently. It was one of the best upgrades we made to our trailer and we upgraded the B190 too. On the B190 the swap took me less than two hours. Progressive Dynamics makes a unit that is a form/fit/function replacement for the old single-stage chargers typically found in B190's. Check out this link: http://progressivedyn.com/pd4600_conver ... ement.html

Good luck with the solar system. I'm sure you'll like it.
We sold our 1998 B190, V-10
Currently own a 2010 Airstream Interstate
User avatar
Mark
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 177
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:03 pm
B190 Year: 1997
WBCCI: 0
Location: I get my mail in Carson City, NV

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Mark »

Thanks nvestysly,

That was actually an older photo. I ripped out the converter since my Magnum Inverter/Charger would do its job and also do it far better.

I''ll be out there wiring stuff up today!
If it ain't fun - it ain't done!
User avatar
Kentuckian
Seasoned Traveler
Posts: 346
Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:52 pm
B190 Year: 1993
WBCCI: 0
Location: Kentucky, USA

Re: Installing Solar Panels

Post by Kentuckian »

Mark, It looks like the install is coming along nicely! What battery did you decide to go with?
1993 Airstream B190
Post Reply